[Sigh], Fr. Fr. Fr. Fr. [Laughter] So instead, now, this goat, this completely corrupt goat, has to go outside the camp, the city, outside, back out into the bad place, and its going to Azazel. We are working to restore the entire archive of Fr. Fr. Fr. The A-Team. Another fun thing from Sunday school, ruined by Fr. Im getting a little giddy here, because when we were going over this in our preparation, it was just stunning to me: once you have clarity about, especially what the Old Testament says, theres all kinds of bits of the New Testament that just light up, left and right. The Lord of Spirits en Apple Podcasts Acts, the book of Acts: youve got the coming of the Holy Spirit, filling the creation, on the day of Pentecost, and the day of Pentecost, its the feast of the giving of the Law, but isnt there also a consecration of the Temple associated with that as well, or am I mixing stuff up? Fr. Fr. But where did this word come from? Fr. So Luke 24, you get Christ on the road to Emmaus. Andrew: I feel like that could be on a t-shirt. Fr. Maybe Fr. Fr. Stephen: Yeah, and this was very clearly understood by the earliest readers, because every extra-biblical source we have from the Jewish world treats Azazel as a spiritual being. Fr. Andrew: Yeah, theres this veiling that happens. Fr. She would therefore have passed her DNA to some of her children (especially to her son Canaan) and later descendants, so that individuals of large size and/or psychopathic behavior could therefore reappear later in history. So Greek words in the New Testament are treated as these sort of independent entities without reference to what theyre translating, and then that allows you to pack a whole bunch of things in. Fr. Fr. Father Stephen De Young is the pastor of Archangel Gabriel Orthodox Church (Antiochian) in Lafayette, Louisiana. And if youre listening to us live, you can call in at 855-AF-RADIO; thats 855-237-2346, and we will get to your calls in the second part of todays show. Fr. Hes wrapped about with a scarlet, Fr. With the Day of Atonement ritual, theres two goats, a goat for Yahweh and a goat thats sent off to Azazel, but I thought in Matthew 25 it said that goats go to hell. Stephen: And not just in the way that all words are made up; its very deliberately made up, very deliberately invented to describe something that there wasnt really another good word in the English language for. [Disgusted noises] All this disillusioning. Disclaimers. And by the way, those handful of later Greek usages seem to be based on the Jewish use of it, meaning its used in contexts where someone is making some kind of offering to a supernatural being, to a spiritual being. Fr. So hes sort of the main motivator of that. A lot of them who didnt know 2 and 3 John existed accepted 1 John. Dont mention that! Fr. Fathers Andrew Stephen Damick and Stephen De Young focus on enchantment in creation, the union of the seen and unseen as made by God and experienced by mankind throughout history. I do I will say, I acknowledge the King James Bible has some errors in it, translation errorsand we just lost all of our KJV-only listeners the one. Andrew: Yeah, right, because there is not just the problem of the sins of the people. Yeah, so St. Matthew uses this language to describe I mean, to describe exactly what happens to Christ at the crucifixion. Fr. Fr. Fr. Dan: I have two questions, if thats okay. I think thats the King James Version, at the beginning of Acts. Fr. The views of select philosophers and theologians on the implications of the Mesopotamian and apocryphal texts in the testaments will be explored. The Religion of the Apostles: Orthodox Christianity in the First Welcome to the second half of the show, here on Goat Week at The Lord of Spirits podcast. So theres this orderly, beautiful, purified, sacred space where God dwells with his people, and then chaos is whats on the outside. Fr. [Laughter] Not because Gods going to get angry Its not like: I said no green M&Ms! [Laughter] Its because of his holiness and his purity that is dangerous to sinful people, to sinful humanity, and God does not want his people, when he comes to visit them, to be destroyed with their sins. Stephen is also the host of the Whole Counsel of God podcast from Ancient Faith and author of the Whole Counsel Blog. And a very well-known biblical scholar and a very good biblical scholar, Simon Gathercole, who wrote the magisterial material on the Gospel of Thomas, for example, amongst many other great things, did a book a few years ago on atonement, trying to defend the particular atonement theory of penal substitutionary atonement. You get these atonement theories that are then theories of how it works from Gods end; how God does it. So, I dont know, its cool. Fr. Fr. And from that perspective, it just doesnt make sense. Fr. Were the Nephilim Genetically Psychopathic? If you have a Facebook account you should probably delete it, but if you cant, like our Facebook page and join our Facebook discussion group where well be your oasis amongst the evils of social media. Dan: Oh, yeah, Im here! Fr. Fr. Andrew: Awesome. Andrew Stephen Damick and Ancient Faith Radio, Dr. Jeannie Constantinou and Ancient Faith Radio, Fr. Fr. Stephen De Young begins the discussion of Romans 1. But also that theres a fundamental question that gets asked in the West, and it comes under the banner of atonement, despite the fact that theres not a whiff of it that weve seen in our survey tonight, and thats not just How does salvation work? but How does salvation work from Gods end? Its not a question of How does salvation work? in the sense of What must I do to be saved? which is a salutary questionpardon the punbut it is How does it work from Gods end? Andrew: Indeed. Fr. Sorry, I will not get tired. Fr. Stephen: And the next verse in 1 John, verse 13, says that the reason he killed Abel is that Abels works were good and Cains works were evil. . It has this sort of importance as a major battle site. So I mention all that because, as we read Scripture more and as we live the Christian life more, if we understand what it is that Christ is doing and how the Scripture tells us what hes doing, then that gives meaning to so much of our lives. Fr. Stephen: So what you see, after that indictment is read, in 1 Enoch and in Slavonic Enoch and in the Apocalypse of Abraham, the same thing happens to Azazel in all of them: Azazel gets bound and chained up and thrown into a hole in the ground and imprisoned there until the end of days, until the day of the Lord, at which point he will be released briefly and then thrown into the lake of fire. And when we were talking about this, you mentioned that, in terms of the actual construction of the language there, its a parallel construction, that Yahweh and Azazel are being used in parallel. Stephen: Right, we have to have it perfect, because hes going to appear, and if he appears and its imperfect, then this is going to get bad for us, for Israel. Fr. So tonight were wrapping up this three-part series on sacrifice by talking about atonement. And then theres this weird And then at the end of Luke: They worshiped him, returned to Jerusalem with great joy, and were continually in the Temple, blessing and praising God. I think weve seen tonight how a lot of discussions of atonement are based on reading backwards, so you start with a developed theological idea, read it back into the New Testament, and then from there back into the Old Testament, instead of what we hopefully did with reasonable success tonight, which is start in the Old Testament and read forward and see how things unfold. Disclaimers, Pauls Works of the Law in the Perspective of Second Century Reception, by Matthew J. Thomas A Review, John the Presbyter: Eusebius Imaginary Friend. Now, this doesnt mean, like, he was Santa, keeping a list all year, like the high priest was going around spying on people and seeing all the stuff they did and writing it down. Father Stephen De Young's comments on political converts Stephen De Young's article, Here There Be Giants which, just as Farley's, was posted to the Ancient Faith Ministries website: "The V. Rev. Photius, welcome to The Lord of Spirits podcast. As a bridge between the discussion of Christ in St. Paul's epistles and Christ in the General Epistles, it is important to discuss a second factor in St. Paul's understanding of Christ as God. Furthermore, I will attempt to explicate theories on the origin of evil and provide the verses that were utilized to support these theories. It becomes this mechanism that I sort of get benefited that benefits me, rather than something that I ritually participate in. Andrew: Yeah! Andrew: Nothing to do with that. Stephen: [Laughter] Right. Fr. So we have again in Leviticus 16 a fair amount of detail describing exactly whats going on. Okay, now we get to talk about one of my favorite placesEmmaus! Fr. Fr. Stephens historical research dismantled beliefs that I held in common with thousands of other modern Christians about the Bible and its teachings. Its not a big mystery. And if they did, what was that signifying when they laid hands on it? Item No. But, yeah, the goat for Azazel has sins placed upon it, in contrast for the goat for Yahweh. Lord of Spirits: Sons of God, Equal to the Angels. Stephen: And finally, be sure to go to ancientfaith.com/support and help make sure we and lots of other AFR podcasters stay on the air. Fr. Photius Avant: I am. Fr. To browse Academia.edu and the wider internet faster and more securely, please take a few seconds toupgrade your browser. It says that Christ is the atonement or the propitiation for our sins, not for ours only but also for the whole world. Stephen: Right, they have to be GOAT goats. Fr. Hope for the Future and the Religion of the Apostles | with Fr. Stephen So we dont know how it was killed. Andrew: So, okay, a question that suddenly occurs to me is I mean, theres kind of a generalnow, maybe Im wrong about this, but I thought there was kind of a general rule of Dont touch the ark of the covenant, and of course Ive seen Raiders of the Lost Ark; I know what happens if you open it. Is he just saying, Im going to come into this. Fr. Partially reviewing what the paper states about the Bible specifically. Youre not sacrificing a goat to Yahweh and then sacrificing another goat to Azazel. Fr. But firstand this is where the English language nerd in me comes leaping outlets talk about this English word, atonement. Okay, so, Fr. Andrew: Yeah, so you have two goats I suddenly remember that joke that goes around on Facebook: You have two cows and then it has this list of all these economic systems. Fr. Fr. Stephen: In fact, its canonically forbidden to bring livestock into the church. Like, its lovely; its a very nice idea. Fr. Fr. Fr. Stephen: Thats the indictment thats sort of read over Azazel before he at this eschatological Day of Atonement. So Azazel and Second Temple literature. Stephen: Yeah, so I dont want to get too granular about this, because theres actually, when you get into literature about thisI did my dissertation related to this, so I read all the literature on this. Emmaus isnt mentioned anywhere else in the Bible except 1 Maccabees and St. Lukes gospel right here. He is also the high priest who is performing the eschatological Day of Atonement. If you didnt get a chance to call in during the live broadcast, wed love to hear from you either via email at lordofspirits@ancientfaith.com, or you can message us at our Lord of Spirits podcast Facebook page. Fr. So, okay, Christ is both goats. Basically, you extract its blood. Fr. Two Orthodox priests, Fr. To actually go in there to purify that space. But he was particularly significant in the understanding of both Judaism of the Second Temple period and early Christianity as not only the first sinner, as we already talked about a little bit, but also as a teacher of sin. Andrew: Yeah, so this is really cool, and its a really I mean, this is a major kind of transitional thing happening here, where, as youve mentioned a number of times, that the sacrificial system of the Old Testament is basically kind of a management system, managing sin, managing corruption, managing taint and death, and so that what we get in the Second Temple literature is, as you said, once and for all, that theres going to be a Great Day of Atonement, to end them all, so to speak: the ultimate, the fulfillment of all of them. Fr. Photius: Yes, sir. The Religion of the Apostles: Orthodox Christianity in the First Amen. Which is kind of a weird way to end the gospel. https://t.co/vM0ulUmY0s, More than Schooling: The Perils of Pragmatism in Christian Attitudes Toward the Liberal Arts by Robin Phillips https://t.co/wh5X6dP63s, A post shared by Robin Phillips (@robin__phillips), Nine Things I Wish Someone Had Told Me About Parenting Teenagers, Barbados Sea Turtles and the Desire For God, G.K. Chesterton and the Sacramental Imagination, Interview with Ancient Faith about Gratitude in Lifes Trenches, The AI Apocalypse is Happening Right Nowbut not in the way you think, Virtue and Classical Education: A Commencement Address to a Graduating Class, understand ancient texts through the lens of their original context. Stephen: Do you have to pay royalties now that you said that? The Bible refers to people who are (generically) tall, (generically) very tall, or (generically) of great stature. Were about to talk now about how hes also the goat for Yahweh, but I just wanted to link these two things together actually from a very familiar bit of hymnography for Orthodox Christians, and thats from the doxology, whether the little doxology or the great doxology, if I remember correctly, this line is in both, where we sing, O Lord God, Lamb of God, Son of the Father, who takest away the sin of the world; have mercy on us, O thou who takest away the sins of the world. Okay, so he takes away the sin of the world and the sins of the world. They have to be the greatest goats of all time. Stephen De Young inquires into what they reveal about the nature of Christ and His creation. You wouldnt like it. Stephen: Right. And, one way or another, thats going to kill the goat. Stephen: And its not, you know, some kind of sacred gold mined from the holy mountain. Stephen: and now Im going to take away your KJV., Fr. Fr. [Laughter]. Andrew: Yeah, right, and it probably should be noted that that doesnt contradict what came before. Andrew: Yeah, so the goat is sent to Azazel. Thank you very much for listening, everybody. Fr. Now that dome is expanded to encompass the whole world, because Christnot only does he not just send the stuff back to Azazel, he gets rid of Azazel. Thats why this. Andrew: In the noun form, right, when its used for the thing on the top of the ark of the covenant, as mercy-seat, which is lovely. Stephens book with glee, looking forward to having ammunition with which to spar with the next Protestant who told me that all we need is the Scriptures, or the next Orthodox or Catholic who told me that all we need is Scripture plus the Patristics. Were going to see, to tip our hatsspoilersthat in the New Testament, Christ is both goats. Stephen De Young discusses the first three verses of Revelation, Chapter 11. It may be the case that this scholarship does vindicate the claims of Orthodox Church, but much more work needs to be done connecting the dots. So theyre taken out of the world. Thank you so much! And then, so the Israelites are referred to as sheep sort of all through the Old Testament, and their leaders as shepherds, because theyre these sheep who are now set free from Egypt and brought out into this new pasture, all of that symbolism. Stephen: He had to purify himself before he could come back into the camp. They and their children were sprinkled at the blood at the beginning of the old covenant, and now we have been sprinkled and purified with the blood of Christ. So thats the non-narrative theology way to say it. Theyre claiming some kind of economic theory of atonement here! Yeah, no. So the first covering that happens, the reason this is done on this day, as weve mentioned in previous episodes, is that this is the day that Yahweh chose to appear visibly in the holy of holies. Andrew: Yeah, yeah, yeah! So thats what this is about. Fr. Awesome. When I received my copy of The Religion of the Apostles: Orthodox Christianity in the First Century by Fr. Stephen: was making this cloud so that he wouldnt actually see Yahweh when he appeared. Andrew: Yeah, theyre now participating in the eschatological Day of Atonement. To cover the taste of bad food? You take it back.. YouTube Stephen: Right, and as a quick note because you said it quickly, Yom Kippurthe Kippur comes from kefir.. And so then, logically enough, when you find this in its noun formthese same roots are used for both verbs and nouns and also for adjectiveswhen its a noun it means a cover or a covering. Why is that mentioned? One of the big questions that Fr. Stephen: No, no, enjoy what you like. Well say what gets done with it first, then well talk a bit about Azazel. Stephen: And so Antiochus IV EpiphanesEpiphanes meant he was the manifestation of a god on earth. Product details Publisher : Ancient Faith Publishing (October 18, 2021) Language : English Paperback : 160 pages ISBN-10 : 1955890048 ISBN-13 : 978-1955890045 Item Weight : 7.5 ounces All right, well, lets just kind of mop up now. They see this as a kind or type of atonement. Theosisbecoming like Godis perhaps the best-known understanding of . And then this triggers everything: this triggers St. Pauls mission now out to the nations, to go and sort of re-take them. ,The Whole Counsel of God: An Introduction to Your Bible Fr. He is also the host of the Whole Counsel of God podcast from Ancient Faith and author of the Whole Counsel Blog, as well as co-host of the Lord of Spirits podcast. Andrew: Yeah, with a goat-head and big, leathery wings. Dr. Stephen De Young is Pastor of Archangel Gabriel Orthodox Church in Lafayette, Louisiana. 41 min; APR 10, 2023; Revelation 11:4-19 Photius: Oh, man! Stephen: Yes, well, his most well-known work. Fr. Now, a couple notes. [Laughter] So, yeah, thats the word itself. Stephen: like Brass Against and Cybertronic Spree, we refer to cover bands as atonement bands.. Stephen writes in the preface, the Orthodox Churchproclaims that its liturgical ritual and way of life are in complete continuity with that of the apostles This book makes that case. Then the books conclusion has a couple pages suggesting that the Eastern Orthodox Church of today is the most faithful continuation of the apostles legacy. This podcast takes us through the Holy Scriptures in a verse by verse study based on the Great Tradition of the Orthodox Church. On our next episode, were going to be starting a two-part series on sacred geography. Fr. [Laughter]. Fr. That doesnt make it not historical. Fr. Stephen: Right, thats not actually in there, no. I can understand all that, and thats fun: figuring out all the details, all the systems, all the lore. Stephen? That perfect union thereby sanctifies, makes holy, purifies humanity in our basic composition. What does that stuff say about him? Hey, its the sin-goat!, Fr. Like, what did the altar do that it had to atone? Stephen: Yeah, and St. Johns going to say this has happened. Our sins came back to us!. And so, of course, as weve mentioned before in a previous episode, this is over against the Apkallu myth and other similar storiesPrometheus in the Greek tradition. Atonement for the Whole World - The Whole Counsel Blog As talked about in the book of Enoch, this would be Cains line. Fr. I am an omni-nerd. So those are some of my take-aways from our conversation this evening. Just read the I mean, yes, sometimes some passages are very difficult, require a lot of interpretation, but when the question is, What is ritually done with a goat? you could just open up Leviticus and read it. Whats going on there? I have people who dont believe me about that, but you can look it up. Andrew: Yeah, like when were serving liturgy, we turn the page in the book. Stephen: Yeah, but were not just playing the Nope card. Fr. Stephen: Right. Sin messes up the place where you are. Two things had to first happen for Trinitarian theology to be hammered out, or so I thought. Andrew: Thats what it is. Andrew: Yeah, probably. Just as St. Peter had, St. Paul saw the light of Gods glory, and heard a voice from heaven. Theres a text variant there as to whether it says monon or monn. Yeah, and then again Hebrews 10: How much worse punishment do you think will be deserved by the one who has trampled underfoot the Son of Godand heres the important part here, for our purposesand has profaned the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified and has outraged the spirit of grace. So, again, the blood of the covenant does this sanctification. Andrew: Yeah [Laughter] So they just kind of perpetuated what had been done before. And he arguedone of his most prominent arguments that he repeated again again was that penal substitutionary atonement is the only theory of how it works that has a mechanism of how it worksthats his word. Fr. "Atonement" is a word invented for the translation of the Bible into English, because there was no good English word for the concept it describes. Why is that aww! Andrew: Yeah, which makes no sense if you think atone means make up for or pay off or whatever, some kind of satisfaction theology. Once again, I am delighted to announce that I was mistaken. Fr. Lets be clear on that. Stephen De Young wraps up Chapter 5 of Romans. Fr. How could that have happened? He's the host of the Whole Counsel of God podcast and a co-host of the Lord of Spirits podcast from Ancient Faith. Yes, yes, I do have a question, and it pertains to 1 John 2:2. Stephen De Young Easily the most important work in Pauline Studies, and likely in Biblical Studies as a whole, of the current decade is Matthew Thomas' published Oxford dissertation, Paul's "Works of the Law" in the Perspective of Second Century Reception. Consequently, I greeted the arrival of Fr. Andrew: Thats fine. So at the beginning thats Eden or paradise, but then everything outside of it, in comparison. Andrew: Yeah, his single most popular and famous work. Stephen: [Laughter] Because exactly the question you just asked. Fr. Copyright 2023 Apple Inc. All rights reserved. Andrew: Hey, Dan. And it turns out that, before it ever got into the Bible, there was occasionally this contraction of the word at and the word one, so you get at-one, however it would have been pronounced back in, like, the 14th century. The Religion of the Apostles | Fr. Stephen De Young - YouTube Stephen De Young, goes back to what I explained earlier: our understanding of the Judaism of Jesus day has been tinctured by Rabbinic Judaism, which we anachronistically assume reflects the tradition of the Pharisees. Almost from the beginning of the book, Fr. Its not anti-Semitic. Thats okay. Dr. Stephen De Young is Pastor of Archangel Gabriel Orthodox Church in Lafayette, Louisiana. So the other goat is for Azazel. Religion of the Apostles: Orthodox Christianity in the First Century If it read that way, then youre asking the natural question, which is what mediates between? In Hebrews 2:14, it says that inasmuch as the children have taken part of the flesh and blood, he himself likewise shared in the same, so this is talking about why Christ became incarnate: Why did Christ become incarnate? So that means the one thats going to be used for the more positive and holy purpose has to be pure, unblemished, no broken bones, not a runt, etc., but since it could be either, they both have to be that. Email Newsletter, Terms of Use Privacy Policy Permissions Content Disclaimer. Andrew: Yeah, so its an interesting point because what is St. Matthew doing? So hes not sacrificed to Azazel. Fr. Andrew: Yeah, because if theres anything God does not want you to do, its worship anything, anything else. Its just a good, good word for one thing, but yeah, yeah. Andrew: Yeah, so we have in our notesbecause everyone loves it when we read from Enochic literature1 Enoch 10:8. And then, through the sinning thats going on around them and even within them, they develop this taint where they are made common again. Not so great for the goat, but it keeps that from happening, which would be a very awkward moment. Stephen De Young is the author of God Is a Man of War and The Religion of the Apostles from Ancient Faith Publishing. This element of the eschatological Day of Atonement, that Azazel is finally defeatedits not just sending him back his sin while he continues to control the rest of the world out there, but hes done away with and disposed ofis, as we said Hebrews is going to be peppered all the way through here. Stephen: Because of this sort of schism in the way we bizarrely celebrate scholarship of the New Testament from the Old Testament. Andrew: So this is not a sacrifice in the meal sense that weve been talking about. Stephen: Actually, it was sprinkled with the finger, so the high priest would have a bowl in which the blood was collected, and he smears it with his finger on pretty much everything but the ark.
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